Old school guy needs help!

[RTexasF]

Mark,

AG just had (maybe still has?) a sale on the Griot's machine. That is highly unusual when they discount any of the polishers and doesn't happen often. I see nothing intriguing with the newest Griot's.....same performance different cover. As you mentioned there could well be some price cuts to clear inventory on all sites. Don't forget that Autogeek price matches if you find a better deal elsewhere and you'll not find better customer service.

[MarkD51]

I would like adding something to this thread, as I have gone back and read all of what all of you people have written, and told me quite a few times.

Honestly, I think the brain actually works better while sleeping! Some clearer thought, and other thoughts about processes, and what perhaps should be done with my particular vehicle.

Of the products many of you have recommended, such as Claying, and other good products such as the Pinnacle Paint Scrubbing product.

Of course Claying is done by hand, and from reading info on many of the products listed here on Auto geek, the Paint Scrubbing Formula can as well be used by hand effectively.

Others, that Wolfgang make, such as a paint scrubber, with glaze added might be another such highly worthy product which can be either used by hand, or by DA Machine.

I've actually been more fanatical about the care of my Tahoe's paint, than my 1967 Corvette Convertible (owned from '77-85), and my 1968 SS396 Camaro (owned from '86-88) That, and other observations are that my wisdom about the use of many products had grown, and as well, the advent within the last 20 years of cutting edge products that weren't around back in the olden days. Things such as Clay Bars, Glazes, and other car care products are truly at the "pinnacle" of evolution today, nothing at all like the products of old, in which many were ineffective, or there was just nothing available (such as Clay Bars) to deal with paint overspray, or adhered surface contaminants on the paint finish.

There was always the reluctancy of taking machine to this vehicle. I was well aware that a machine could speed up processes, and in a professional's instance, it would be insanity to hand apply processes, unless one wished to take two weeks to properly do a customer's vehicle.

I'm aware that a professional will encounter many "basket cases", in which hand processes will just not properly work to achieve the desired results. I've been in this situation numerous times myself, doing people's vehicles, both collector cars, and daily drivers.

For my own needs, I can no doubt "get away" without the need, and use of any DA Machine. There is no damage, there is no swirls, and all I'm noticing, is a slight lack of highly reflective show car gloss. There's a little bit of loss in this area, and that can possibly be attested to a build up of old waxes-sealants, and that the bare paint needs a little TLC in adding some lotions to feed, and clean the paint.

I'll well aware of the pitfalls, and hazards to even seemingly simple uses of Waxers, and can envision the same for the DA Polishers. As one has mentioned, too much abrasion, and there's no going back, and the same applies to one little mistake, a bang into a mirror, not properly masking ornaments, trim, can spell disaster, and irreversible damage.

Like all of you folks, I'd prefer "not" to go there! LOL

That, and the rare occasion of equipment failure that I've read that can happen to virtually any of the machines, and another possible cause of mishap damage, I might be able to "get away" with only hand use of cutting edge products. As you would no doubt all smartly advise, "Do the least amount to attain the desired results".

I've pretty much "retired" from doing other's vehicles at the present, and don't envison doing such for the foreseeable future.

I'd think I'll be keeping my eyes open for specials of products from the Pinnacle, Wolfgang lines, and as well perhaps a few more products that will compliment my personal vehicle, such as some Vinyl-Rubber Care products, and some small array of complimentary tools, towels, applicators.

I can always add the DA Machine down the road.

As I close, the only forseeable problem is where again to store it all? I thing I have more car car products on hand than the local Auto Zone store! LOL
Mark

[MarkD51]

Here's a old story, perhaps might be long, and hopefully not boring.

Many years ago, I was asked to detail, and fix a best friend's car, which he had bought just a month earlier. "Cadillac Jimmy's Car" was a extremely clean, all original all black 1965 Cadillac Calais. Bought it from a "little old lady"! LOL

After James got through with the car, he said it looked even worse, and wanted the car looking right, as he wanted to place the car in an auto show the following weekend.

Hence, this is where I come in. James said the car was nothing but a big mass of streaks, swirls, clouds, and the paint just basically was looking like crap after his efforts.

He was living in Addision, Ill at the time, and myself in Chicago. So off I go with an entire trunkful worth of products, and tools, pads, bonnets, etc.

At the time, I was largely dealing with a now long gone wax factory in Chicago called "Nu Look". They made a lot of really superb products, specifically catering to the detailing shops abroad.

I had considerable reservations initially of even taking on the job, the compliments, and the important need of my abilities were of course nicely taken, but I then knew my abilties were going to be placed in an extremely demanding position. That what I was going to do, would have no compromise, what I would do would have to be no less than perfect for this specific job.

When I personally inspected the vehicle, I knew I was going to be in for hell, as there were light scratches, haze, swirls, and a lack of luster.
I did confer with the owner of Nu Look, Frank D'Amato beforehand, as to what would be the best choices within his personal lines of products.

The vehicle did need High Speed Buffing, Polishing, and then a final wax, and detail. I was indeed scared shitless of taking high speed buffer to 25 year old Laquer Paint.

I spent a total of 8 hours doing the major processes, and concentrating on the major flaws to get James "out of the woods", and would leave any minor detailing processes such as Door Jambs, Interior Cleanup and Detail to him, and left him an entire cardboard box worth of detailing sprays, interior cleaners, waxes, polishes, Tire Cleaners-Treatments, and a host of Perfumes. Frank must've had the largest selection of Perfumes on the planet, about 40 in all.

I think I lost 6 lbs in sweat with the work, and worry with that car! LOL

The car was looking magnificent, like one huge black mirror. The Pink Magic pure Liquid Carnauba that Frank used to make ($13 Gallon) at the time was really a fantastic product.

James was 100% happy with the work, but I still had reservations about how my work would be taken by car show enthusiasts, and perhaps Judges? And as well, whether my work would be seen as properly done as time passed, and whether that work would stand the test of time?

I got the call from James the next day following the Car Show.

It was all great news, he took a "Best in Show" out of about 100-125 vehicles.

The Judge's first questions, were, "Who painted the Car", and James told them, "GM did 25 years ago!" They couldn't beleve it.

They also commented that "He had the best smelling car at the Show! :-)

That was the "Bubble Gum" Perfume he decided to use, which used to smell just like Juicy Fruit Gum.

James still has that car, now lives in Sarasota Florida, has amassed probably 150 Trophies, and has earned himself the name "Cadillac Jimmy". He's been a car club president down there for quite a few years as well, and probably does shows almost every weekend.

The car still wears the original Paint! Mark

[MarkD51]

http://kara-fla.org/home.html

Here's his club's website, got his ugly face (LOL) plastered on the main page, yet not one pic of his Caddy on the slide show of vehicles.

[DaveT435]

Originally Posted by MarkD51

I would like adding something to this thread, as I have gone back and read all of what all of you people have written, and told me quite a few times.

Honestly, I think the brain actually works better while sleeping! Some clearer thought, and other thoughts about processes, and what perhaps should be done with my particular vehicle.

Of the products many of you have recommended, such as Claying, and other good products such as the Pinnacle Paint Scrubbing product.

Of course Claying is done by hand, and from reading info on many of the products listed here on Auto geek, the Paint Scrubbing Formula can as well be used by hand effectively.

Others, that Wolfgang make, such as a paint scrubber, with glaze added might be another such highly worthy product which can be either used by hand, or by DA Machine.

I've actually been more fanatical about the care of my Tahoe's paint, than my 1967 Corvette Convertible (owned from '77-85), and my 1968 SS396 Camaro (owned from '86-88) That, and other observations are that my wisdom about the use of many products had grown, and as well, the advent within the last 20 years of cutting edge products that weren't around back in the olden days. Things such as Clay Bars, Glazes, and other car care products are truly at the "pinnacle" of evolution today, nothing at all like the products of old, in which many were ineffective, or there was just nothing available (such as Clay Bars) to deal with paint overspray, or adhered surface contaminants on the paint finish.

There was always the reluctancy of taking machine to this vehicle. I was well aware that a machine could speed up processes, and in a professional's instance, it would be insanity to hand apply processes, unless one wished to take two weeks to properly do a customer's vehicle.

I'm aware that a professional will encounter many "basket cases", in which hand processes will just not properly work to achieve the desired results. I've been in this situation numerous times myself, doing people's vehicles, both collector cars, and daily drivers.

For my own needs, I can no doubt "get away" without the need, and use of any DA Machine. There is no damage, there is no swirls, and all I'm noticing, is a slight lack of highly reflective show car gloss. There's a little bit of loss in this area, and that can possibly be attested to a build up of old waxes-sealants, and that the bare paint needs a little TLC in adding some lotions to feed, and clean the paint.

I'll well aware of the pitfalls, and hazards to even seemingly simple uses of Waxers, and can envision the same for the DA Polishers. As one has mentioned, too much abrasion, and there's no going back, and the same applies to one little mistake, a bang into a mirror, not properly masking ornaments, trim, can spell disaster, and irreversible damage.

Like all of you folks, I'd prefer "not" to go there! LOL

That, and the rare occasion of equipment failure that I've read that can happen to virtually any of the machines, and another possible cause of mishap damage, I might be able to "get away" with only hand use of cutting edge products. As you would no doubt all smartly advise, "Do the least amount to attain the desired results".

I've pretty much "retired" from doing other's vehicles at the present, and don't envison doing such for the foreseeable future.

I'd think I'll be keeping my eyes open for specials of products from the Pinnacle, Wolfgang lines, and as well perhaps a few more products that will compliment my personal vehicle, such as some Vinyl-Rubber Care products, and some small array of complimentary tools, towels, applicators.

I can always add the DA Machine down the road.

As I close, the only forseeable problem is where again to store it all? I thing I have more car car products on hand than the local Auto Zone store! LOL
Mark

I've been quietly watching this thread for a while now. I know a lot of things are hard to see on white paint...you would see every one of them on your friends Caddy. If you want to give it a go by hand more power to you my friend. I will tell you that your looking at a lot of real estate!! I would say 20-40 hours worth to put a high gloss shine on it. So really I guess it depends on what kind of price you put on your fee time. How many hours do you have to save to be worth 130.00-170.00. I know you say there aren't scratches. It's been my experience that regular towels put very fine scratches in the clear...and going over a fairly dirty area and continuing to wash without rinsing or changing wash media leaves fine scratches. I would say...and this is just my opinion that 70-80% of the loss of luster is caused by little fine scratches. It really doesn't matter to me if you buy a DA or not..and like you said you can buy it later. Just trying to save you some time and very sore arms.

[MarkD51]

Originally Posted by DaveT435

I've been quietly watching this thread for a while now. I know a lot of things are hard to see on white paint...you would see every one of them on your friends Caddy. If you want to give it a go by hand more power to you my friend. I will tell you that your looking at a lot of real estate!! I would say 20-40 hours worth to put a high gloss shine on it. So really I guess it depends on what kind of price you put on your fee time. How many hours do you have to save to be worth 130.00-170.00. I know you say there aren't scratches. It's been my experience that regular towels put very fine scratches in the clear...and going over a fairly dirty area and continuing to wash without rinsing or changing wash media leaves fine scratches. I would say...and this is just my opinion that 70-80% of the loss of luster is caused by little fine scratches. It really doesn't matter to me if you buy a DA or not..and like you said you can buy it later. Just trying to save you some time and very sore arms.

Hello Dave,

Firstly, I wish to say thank you!

Your post is what I would like to refer to, as "The Undisputed Truth".

I doubt that there would be one detailer, amateur, or professional, who would debate, or discount what you've said-written. And I won't either, I think you are 100% correct.

I think that I will either get all the "little goodies", and then a DA Polisher, whichever comes first, I cannot say, but I will try finding some good deals, where I can maybe feel good about saving a few centavos.

No bites yet on my monstrous Milwaukee Rotary, or "Wax Slinger" machines. I didn't have much high hopes here. If I priced the Milwaukee at $15, even a cake baker would be calling me here. That's the tough breaks of living here I'm afraid. People here are super "el cheapo".

I don't wish to bombard you great folks with an over excess on this particular post, but will perhaps keep all you kind folks informed about my little destination, and where it leads me.

Thank you again sir! Mark

[MarkD51]

To all you fine folks.

Perhaps this particular thread is getting a bit long in the tooth?

I'm sorry that I do have a sort of bad habit, I talk too much! :-)

I've placed a lot of thoughts to writing, but I do need to "button my lips", and listen more to you folks.

I have watched a couple of Mike's videos earlier.
You folks are all correct. There's going to be no way to attain such high quality end results by hand alone. I should not be having any phobias, or apprehensions of using such a machine like the Porter Cable 7424XP.

Perhaps I'm a little afraid, as I've gotten older, and haven't really kept up with many of the processes.

Mike's "how to" techniques, and expertise is easy, and straightforward to clearly understand. They are mostly things that I used to basically know in the past.

I think I'm liking the Porter Cable Machine, and this will most likely be the one I will buy.

I will perhaps start another thread soon, and again, I'm going to try hard to listen more, ask pertinent questions, as you folks do have more experience than I with these newer machines-processes.

I'll continue to read and study the archives, and will earnestly try absorbing more knowledge.

Thank you again all, very much for your help, and advice! You guys are all really great! Mark

[Nicholas@Autowerx]

Originally Posted by MarkD51

I think I'm liking the Porter Cable Machine, and this will most likely be the one I will buy.

You won't be disappointed. It is a great machine and will save you TONS of time and give better results compared to trying to polish your paint by hand. Due to the design of the machine it is also incredibly safe so any apprehension you may have about possibly damaging your vehicle should be slim to none.

It sounds like you are well on your way to becoming a true AutoGeek! Keep watching those videos and asking those questions... your paint will be shiny in no time!

[Mike.Phillips@Autogeek]

Originally Posted by MarkD51

I think I'm liking the Porter Cable Machine, and this will most likely be the one I will buy.

With any of the 5.5" thin foam pads or the new evolution of microfiber pads, you can do a lot with a Porter Cable 7424XP and it's a tool with a time-proven reliability record.

And safe?

Removing Swirls and Oxidation By Machine

How To Remove Oxidation by..." target="_blank">How To Remove Oxidation by...

[MarkD51]

Mike, you truly are a mind blower. Mucho thanks for "stopping in".

I am truly so gosh darn "itchy" right now, I know I am going to be staggered by my next month's credit card statement! LOL

Money no object, I could easily spend $1000 with the auto geek folks, and be about 55% there!

Detailing is like a drug. Sadly, I have just too many other hobbies, like Drums, Music, Astronomy, and they can all lead to being "very rich man's hobbies".

McIntosh Audio Gear, Handmade precision Optics, Collector Vintage Drums, I am truly sick! Hee hee.

But, I'm very happy with the person I am. Wouldn't have it any other way!
Thanks again Mike, love ya! Mark